If you know anything about me, you need to know that I believe God is good all the time, and everything that I look at or encounter in life is framed in that perspective.
This last week in my home body we lost two beloved friends to cancer. This is a huge deal to us because we as a body have declared that our city will be a cancer free zone. A zone where the presence of God is so strong that cancer absolutely can not exist. That may sound like a pipe dream but that is what we have been striving for and we believe it will happen. When we appear to have setbacks like this last week, we won't pretend that they didn't happen and ignore the facts. Instead we embrace them, and then stand on what we know, that God is good all the time and his will for us is to have healing all the time, because he is good, and by being good God, he can't have it any other way.
Here is an excerpt from a sermon mix that was done on this topic.
God is good all the time. The devil is bad, all the time. We would do ourselves a service if we could just remember the two. God- Good. Devil- Bad. Cancer- bad. I wonder where it comes from. Here is problem: The church of this nation has become so deprived of the real Gospel that we have formulated ways of thinking that are anti-Christ in nature and they are called "spiritual". They embrace sickness and disease as a gift from God to help us become better people. It is a lie from hell. It is blasphemy to attribute to God the very work of the devil. It is inconsistent for Jesus to pay a price for our healing and for us to believe that it is not God's intention to heal. Now, here is the conflict, you pray for somebody and they didn't get healed and they died. So we have to live with this tension of what I understand and what I don't understand. Through out church history, we have this puzzle of, "aunt Martha dies, we prayed, we fasted we did everything we knew how to do; it must have been God's choice not to heal her". Well is that true? You see, 2000 years ago God chose to heal her, that is why Jesus went and bore 39 stripes on his body. Enough stripes on his back to remove the skin and expose his internal organs. It was a payment he made, it says he was punished, in the punishment that I deserved, so that we can get what he deserves. How can he decide to not buy something he already bought. It is too late, it is already paid for. That is why the scriptures declare, by his stripes you were healed, the work was done, it is accomplished, it is finished. So why then do we live with problems that don't get answered. What the church does then, is it wants answers so badly, it begins to make up answers to feel good about our present condition. But to do it we have to take one of the absolutes of God's goodness, we bring it over, and we sacrifice it on the alter of human reasoning. And so then we have people that will stand up and say, "God gave my relative leukemia to teach a perseverance." No, No No. What does the bible say? He forgives all your iniquities, he heals all your diseases. We would never think this: Let's say we have someone who committed a horrible sin, and then they come to me and say, you know, I was praying the other day, and I did something stupid and I asked the Lord to forgive me and he said, no, he really doesn't want to. It would never enter our mind that God would in some way turn someone down who needed forgiveness of sin. Because we don't yet get it that when Jesus taught of forgiveness of sin he taught of physical affliction in the same breath. "Which is easier to say, "Son your sins are forgiven or pick up your bed and walk?" The Christian life is an invitation to live in between two conflicting realities because you see, the cross is not bearing up under physical affliction. The sufferings of the bible are not physical affliction, the sufferings of the bible are living between two conflicting realities and living with trust and praise at the same time. He is still good all the time.
For more go to http://www.jesusculture.org/
media player, message mix
It is titled God is Good by Bill Johnson.
Let me know what you think about this and if you have any questions. It may be a bit out there for you so I'd be happy to address anything you might have.
Peace,
Jon
Posts
7 comments:
Jon--I have a few questions about the theology behind this post.
Where in the Bible does it say that He came to save us from our diseases here on earth?
Why have you chosen to declare your city a cancer free zone? Why not an abortion free zone? Or just declare it a city of people who are fully surrendered and on their knees in prayer before the Throne of Grace?
We live in a fallen world...a world that has cancer because it *is* a fallen world. No matter what...GOD IS SOVEREIGN! HE ALWAYS IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE!
Can you please explain your views here further...I might not be fully understanding your post.
Hey guys,
Thank you so much for your feedback. Having an actual discourse makes the blog so much more interesting. I'd love to expound and answer questions on this topic because it is my favorite topic to discuss.
First @ anonymous:
Isaiah 53 is where I'd start, the prophet is laying out the description of the Messiah that will come, when he gets to verse 5 he says "by his stripes you are healed". This was a foretelling of the 39 stripes Jesus received before he was crucified and what their significance would be. There are other supporting passages as well, plus the whole life of Jesus is a mix of forgiving of sins and healing of sickness.
As to the cancer free zone, we feel that was a corporate mandate from God for our specific "tribe" here, if you will. While we pray for the others causes you mentioned as well as a body, and there are individuals within who dedicate themselves to eradicating abortion and getting the lost saved, we corporately have lasered in on the cancer free zone. It's not like we don't want those things or don't care about them, we do, we just have picked the fight with cancer to start with. Does that make sense? I've heard of other places focused on a diabetes free zone, or a poverty free zone, etc.
As to your last comment, I absolutely agree that God is Sovereign, always have, always will. The world does have cancer in it because it is fallen, but we serve a Savior who has conquered all and is lives inside us. It is by his name and authority that we fight this plague. We won't tolerate something that has already been defeated. I hope that answers your questions. If not, I'd love to go on...
@ the counselor:
hey, thanks for the feedback. To your first point, I could also say God is always good and therefore it is always his will that everybody would repent and get saved. That is based on a verse like 2 Peter 3:9 "It is his will that none would perish, but all would come to repentance." Now, obviously not all come to repentance, but that doesn't mean that God doesn't want that. I'm saying it is the exactly the same for healing. Jesus always said what the Father said and did what the Father did, and he never turned anyone away from healing saying, "No, it would be better for you to keep being sick. It will make you a better person and more like me. " He always wants it, because he is a good God and he wants to give good things. If it doesn't happen that way for us now, that doesn't change who he is. We live in a world of conflict, with sin running rampant all over, it is a war zone, and sometimes there are casualties. That doesn't change who he is or what he wants.
I did read Piper's sermon. Here is what I have to say to that. Piper is an awesome man of God, I love his passion for Christ, for not wasting life, for fighting the good fight. I have read his books, listened to his sermons, I love his heart and I respect him. On this issue, however, I have a different perspective. i know he has scripture to back his perspective up, but so do I. This is just one of those deals where I "agree to disagree". He believes his perspective to be true, and to him it is true, and because his prayers match his beliefs, they get answered accordingly. My prayers match my beliefs, and so they get answered accordingly. Here is what that looks like in a nutshell. Piper is in this case saying that all that good stuff that Jesus did isn't really for now, and that victory he won isn't for now, that is for when he comes back again. (although God can do it whenever he wants during this time) I'm saying, all that good stuff that Jesus modeled for us is for now, the victory he won is for now, he already paid for it, lets go get it and bring it into reality because he wants it to happen now. So, i believe this is one of those things where you can't really find a middle ground on. Either you agree or disagree, depending on what you feel is right. I don't judge Piper for what he believes, I am cool with him no matter what. I just know this is what God has highlighted for me, so I have to go after it with all my heart. Peace,
JON
Thanks.
I'm not entirely sure about the Paul scripture you gave, but as great of an example as he is, I'm not called to be like Paul, I'm called to be like Jesus and to follow him. Jesus never turned someone away, he also never gave anyone sickness to make them a better person or to humble them or make them weak. Jesus is perfect theology.
I'm not comfortable judging Piper's prayers or fruit of them, this isn't a contest or pray off. i can only guess that it would be hard to pray with faith when you aren't even sure if what you are praying for is God's will.
It is hard enough to pray with faith when you are sure it is his will. I have seen some amazing things happen when I pray, but unfortunately, not every time i pray. I'm still trying to grow in this and hear the Father better. If you are looking for me to give you all the answers I'm going to disappoint you. There are somethings I just don't know or care to have an opinion about.
Just to be clear. I honor Paul as an Apostle and a tool of the Holy Spirit to author scripture. I'm not trying to take away from that. I'm saying if a topic that is gray because we don't know all the components, and it seems to be in conflict with the life of Jesus, I'm going to side with Jesus. The same goes for Piper. I honor him as a man of God and a tool used to bring encouragement and life to the body. But if he says something that is in conflict with the life of Jesus, I have to go with Jesus.
Peace,
Jon
All of my beliefs on healing are rooted in the life of Jesus, the Healer. That is the source. Anything else outside of his life that "seems" to contradict what he did, I will not allow to cloud, or in any way take away from what he did. That is my story, and I'm sticking to it. :)
Counselor,
I addressed the Paul question with Jake on another post so I'll address the Piper question here with you. Basically what I was trying to say is that Piper has a non-aggressive and very open ended approach towards praying for sickness, so it shouldn't be a surprise if the results are not clearly revealed, and are open, and support the belief. Another way of putting it will be if you believe you can't run a mile, and never try to, you are correct, you can't run a mile, and your beliefs are true. Does that make sense?
I hope I'm articulating this well, because I don't want to take away from Piper's ministry but I want to highlight the difference in how we pray.
Peace,
Jon
Post a Comment